hatespeech

wetnurse

New Member
Hi I'm a longtime transgender user.

So I'm wondering, after repeatedly being called 'tranny' and 'man' in the cam room yesterday by a couple of (not guest) regular users. And after approaching moderator AsianSlut to ask her if there was anything she could do to stop that only to be rebuffed on the grounds that "google said it's not considered a slur by everyone".

Given that most reputable sites have 'tranny' flagged/banned as hatespeech in 2019, is there any likelihood of FreeChatNow modernising its policies to stay in step with contemporary cultural/commercial norms in the coming decade or is the intent to indefinitely maintain a regressive environment that is hostile to transgender folks?
 
There is no moderator with an @ASIANSLUT username.

Report such activity using the report feature, by clicking on the usernames and selecting "REPORT."
 
There is no moderator with an @ASIANSLUT username.

Report such activity using the report feature, by clicking on the usernames and selecting "REPORT."

Sorry I couldn't recall the name exactly - it's @SexyAsianBitch

no doubt it will show up in your schedule - the individual mod is not important tbh

another mod later joined while users were still calling me male/man and likewise did nothing. This isn't about an individual moderator - it's a systemic issue within your company.

I was previously instructed in this type of situation to REPORT it to a mod - I REPORTED it to a mod in some detail.

I don't understand why you are instructing me to go to the trouble of REPORTING the hatespeech if the site doesn't codify it as hatespeech? That doesn't make sense and instead sounds like a runaround and a waste of users' time.

my question remains:

Given that most reputable sites have 'tranny' flagged/banned as hatespeech in 2019, is there any likelihood of FreeChatNow modernising its policies to stay in step with contemporary cultural/commercial norms in the coming decade or is the intent to indefinitely maintain a regressive environment that is hostile to transgender folks?

If the question is above your paygrade, could I request that you push it up the ladder to someone better qualified to answer.
 
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In the meantime this user's ongoing harrassment on my profile and in rooms has been REPORTED.
 

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I'm vitriolicv, the social administrator.

We don't tolerate transphobic hate speech, but we don't have any kind of automatic monitoring set up for it. In fact, such a thing would be incredibly tricky, if not impossible, to implement in a way that wouldn't just flood us with false positives all the time. Hate speech is also tricky to interpret sometimes, especially for people who are not subject to that hate themselves. Therefore, we need for you to present not just raw evidence, but also your case: A narrative account of situations you are reporting, analysis and interpretation of the evidence, and THEN the raw evidence as support for your case. It may be a difficult thing to do dispassionately when you're angry about being the target of hate speech, but lashing out at the mods will never help you to convince them of your case. They aren't rules-robots, into whom you stuff evidence and they plop out bans. They are arbiters and helpers, and you have to treat them like people to get what you want. You have to help them understand what is going on. Things that may be self-evident to you are not necessarily so to others.

An additional complicating factor for hate speech directed at a minority oriented around gender and sexuality is pornography. When it comes to trans women, most of the world's vocabulary is informed by porn, which uses slurs all the time. I've had argument after argument with various cis men, where they insisted that various things were not slurs, either because "it's an abbreviation" and/or because (cis) society doesn't think it's a slur, but ultimately because they just don't give a shit about having any compassion, and that which is normalized (the use of slurs) can't possibly be wrong because everybody does it. Anyway, the fact that FCN is so oriented around sex chat means that slurs heavily used in porn will always be found here, used casually, and it is beyond our ability to use social engineering to make that stop until the rest of society makes it stop. We can intercede when they are directed against a specific person who is present on our network, however; someone referencing "tranny porn" in general is not something we can do anything about, but if anyone actually calls a fellow user a slur, we can then act.

Keep in mind that most mods are cis and will not see occurrences of transphobic hate speech for what it is. Don't badger them. Help them understand.

Next topic: You responded to hate speech by leveling unfounded, admittedly evidenceless allegations of criminal child sex abuse against the user who targeted you. You were banned for that. You can't do that. We take allegations of pedophilia seriously, but cannot allow discussions of pedophilia to take place in public. That kind of thing needs to be shut down, and you can't bring it up. The ONLY place for any talk of pedophilia is when reporting it, through the report tool or via PM/whisper, to the moderators -- with evidence.

Moderators are responsible primarily for keeping the general peace, and secondarily -- because it is ultimately beyond our capability -- for protecting any individual user. I'd like it if more justice were possible, but you can't destroy the general peace when pursuing your own justice.
 
Thank you,

I was already aware that you take spurious and explicitly satirically performative allegations more seriously than the genuine misgendering of trans people.

I was repeatedly called a 'tranny' in the previous above complaint despite myself and another user asking the trans-antagonist user not to refer to us in that manner - it had nothing to do with porn, it was in main - other users were also lamenting how outdated the site's lack of response was even as the moderator sexyasianbitch refused to act and debate the 'slur' credentials of the term.

likewise in this instance another user explicitly referred to me as a man - I've been called a man (unfounded allegations) repeatedly in that room over the past few weeks despite broadcasting cam

mods were paying attention to main - and would have seen it, that's why I was banned - and the user referring to a trans woman as a man wasn't

as for this: "it is beyond our ability to use social engineering to make that stop until the rest of society makes it stop"

well that's obviously not true - pedophilia/incest/beastiality/rape/racism continues in society and yet the site maintains strict protocols in socially engineering how that manifests on site.

See Elon Musk calling one of the Thai Soccer team rescuers a 'pedo' for reference.

as I previously mentioned Facebook has 'tranny' tagged as hatespeech - whereas FCN apparently has protocol in place where moderators argue with trans women whether being labelled as such is offensive.

it's super simple - you evidently don't feel trans women should feel safe on your site

I've made countless reports, and complaints about transphobia on this site in the two years since I joined and not a single one has been upheld

by contrast I've been banned repeatedly for calling it out and pulled up by a moderator on one occasion publicly in the room for being trans and sharing an innocuous pic, I quote:

"Just because you're trans does not mean you can post dick pics in the lesbian room"

the problem was that in my two years here I've never posted a dick pic in the lesbian room - in fact I've only once posted a dick pic - that was on this Saturday just gone, while playing truth or dare - which was posted in the dick rating room -

I'm *attaching* this *not a dick pic* that the moderator (botodd in that case) called out for being a dick pic in the lesbian room, which shows my butt with a small strapon pressed against it, to paint a picture of how petty this type of targetting of trans users is.

so it paints a clear enough picture for me of a moderation team which is not simply prepared to ignore repeated anti-trans rhetoric but a moderation team who will go to some lengths in attempting to target trans users for misperceived infractions - pushing against trans users for years - to the point where i FINALLY LOST MY SHIT.

to be clear - like any other user - I joined this site simply to have fun - I've been using sites like this for decades and this is the most transphobic site of its ilk I've encountered. I certainly didn't join here to be some SJW, but the bias and lack of response to blatant and sustained transmisia and cissexism is so out of step with any other site I currently access that it's impossible to ignore.

it's like stepping into a time capsule.

so you'll be glad to know the simplest and most mutually beneficial response is that i'll leave the site.

tho I'll stick around long enough to confirm you have read this message - as I'm not sure this will show if I delete account immediately.



Thanks for your time and good luck with this!
 

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I personally have specifically posted trans porn in that room just to piss off the TERFs and then given notice that it is absolutely allowed, and then banned anyone who tried to report me for doing it. I have banned people for calling trans women "it", LET ALONE any widely recognized, more explicit slurs. Don't try to tell me what I believe or care about. Don't try to tell me that I haven't tried. You don't know shit.

And Facebook? Fuck Facebook. I've got a few dozen trans friends who have been post-blocked for using slurs self-referentially. Don't act like FACEBOOK is doing it right when they don't give one fuck about context, and to top it off, require disclosure of one's trans status if some random person should report that one's name is "fake."

As for your reports and complaints, I've never seen them. The mods I know who WOULD investigate and punish such things, especially if they happened as plainly and publicly as you have stated, must not have seen them either. I guess these reports can't really have been so countless, after all. Also, you're talking about a large, rotating group of volunteers who all have different personal stances on things, some of whom I know for a fact are the *ahem* "wokest of baes", and saying they're all explicitly transphobic shitlers. But the only two you've named are botodd, who hasn't been a mod at FCN in quite some time, and SexyAsianBitch, who... well let's step back a moment:

I suspect you've never submitted any kind of ban appeal either, because this issue has literally never been escalated to me. Mods have asked me in the past about what we're supposed to do with men in lesbianchat, several times, over a very long time, and I have told them that they can only room-ban people who explicitly *say* that they are men. When that was apparently JUST TOO COMPLICATED for a few mods, and most of the users, our sysadmin actually got so fed up with it that he flipped his shit and changed the topic in that room to something like "men, women, and vulcans welcome!" -- which I thought was a bit trans dismissive, like those "we don't care just wash your hands" bathroom signs, but hey, here we have a room full of drama queens, half of whom are actually just cis men anyway, CONSTANTLY flooding the system with bullshit reports like "halp it am an mans in a girl rome!", drowning out reports that were actually actionable and related to serious offenses.

So you know what I did? I told the mods that the policy would be: If they REALLY want to keep men out of that room, they can ban people who explicitly say they are men, but they are under NO pressure to be in that room in the first place. Because it is a goddamn shithole. But my latest attempt at making it less shitty was to link this (which I wrote) in the topic in that room: https://www.freechatnow.com/blog/gender-lesbian-chat

But I digress -- obviously you have never submitted any ban appeals, because this would have just re-awakened that question that the mods used to constantly ask me about gender in that room, and SexyAsianBitch has no power to delete forum threads (also, I just double checked the ban appeals forum). So, it's either that, or your ban appeals have been of the same quality as this thread, where you just rage and accuse my mods of all being shit, and got your threads closed because you were trying to extract your justice from people who weren't even involved. Sound about right?
 
So I am still fairly new at this. I have been in chat rooms back in the MSN chatroom days and even was a moderator both normal and gold. Back then I only moderated in one room thankfully, and there was no paperwork.
From what I can gather moderators in here not only have paperwork they need to fill out when banning someone.
To top that off sometimes there are only one or two mods in to take care of all of the rooms. Which can not be easy.
 
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