Rights and Freedoms Is nationalism bad?

Maybe Im wrong, maybe Im right. Does it truly matter in the end? This kind of conversation is exactly what I was talking about. The sharing of beliefs leads to greater understanding.

 

Mind if I keep that?

 

Okay, being British this is a complex issue that I shouldn't really be touching on without some kind of backlash regarding my nations imperialistic past....But I will attempt to have a go in a simplistic way.

Yes, you're allowed to be nationalistic, be proud of your nation and all of its success. But, at the same time you have to own the shit your country has done throughout history, you must accept those that have chosen to live in your land because they want a better way of life. This planet is a lot smaller than it used to be and there are a lot of people of different shapes, colours and belief systems. If they live here, and they want to be nationalistic with be, then my arms are open wide....just as long as they take the piss out of the French with me

 

Have you actually heard any of these people you're talking about claim that they stand for intolerance?

It seems to me that any time we hear about members of the supposed "far right" we always hear ABOUT them from people of the polar opposite political persuasion,or we see a 10 second clip or something of them talking which could have been taken from anything,and then a person of a globalist bent explains that what their words REALLY mean is that they want to enslave black people or kill jews with bug spray in wooden shower rooms and turn them into cleaning products and furniture.

Has anyone else ever noticed that? I mean,if this is all about hatred and intolerance, do you not believe that people are smart enough to figure that out themselves if we actually hear these people out in their own words?

I don't need someone telling me what someone REALLY means when they talk. I'm not a 4 year old. I can figure it out myself.

One thing I don't get about the intolerance thing is this: It's hatred if White people want to have their own country with no other people in it or if they want to be a majority in some country on Earth,right?

Is that what everyone here would agree with? That's what I've been told.

Ok,America's going to be majority Hispanic in 2040-2050. Almost every European country will be made up mostly of people who did not found that country very shortly after that. By next century at the latest.

There's not one sub-Saharan African country that's going to be majority White or majority non-African in the next 400 years,let alone the next 40, that we know of.

Does that mean black people are filled with a fanatical hatred and intolerance of non-black people to a point that they are even more vicious and vile than even far right skinheads,since the latter are complaining about being ethnically cleansed,but accepting it mostly peacefully whereas Africans are doing absolutely nothing to diversify their countries and since they violently opposed non-black rule in Haiti,Rhodesia,South Africa,etc?

Do you think that black people are evil because they don't want diversity?

What about Korean people,like the OP? Are they intolerant for wanting their country to be Korean?

Let's bring it down to a local scale.

Let's say you run a convenience store and someone else just moves all of their stuff into your building and starts selling their products there,hanging their signage directly over yours, and making a special effort to shit-talk your products to your most loyal customers,taking your business away from you and bankrupting you in the process, are you intolerant for wanting to do business under the roof that you pay taxes for or do you believe you have a right to kick out the people who are squatting on your property and damaging your brand?

 

All 3 and a half billion of them? Is that even physically possible?

 

They post their views on Reddit and in videos for everyone to see. Stop living in a bubble and only getting your news from Fox. I'm not going to debate with you on whether the far right exists. I do not debate facts with people who only believe in non facts and the biased opinions of the right and their fake news. Continue living in your bubble. When it comes time for it to burst you will have no one to blame but you.

 

It seems like you are living in a bubble. You have no way of knowing where I get my news or anything about me but you are already circling the wagons around a handful of talking points with no direct relation to anything I am talking about.

Let's stick to facts that we can prove if we're going to have a discussion.

When you say they post their views on reddit and whatnot, I would like to see a serious,factual statement by someone you consider to be far right that says:

"My views are motivated entirely by intolerance of people who are different from me. It has nothing whatsoever to do with any harm to my community or my economic prospects or damage to the environment. I am motivated by no concern other than that I hate people based on the color of their skin and/or their religion."

You're not going to find that. You know how I know you're not going to find that? Because it sounds like a fucking cartoon. It doesn't sound like a position that an actual person takes,it sounds like something that you put in someone's mouth for propaganda purposes so you have a boogeyman because the person you are attacking is saying something that sounds universally mean to everybody.

There's a bunch of ways you can frame this issue but it seems like the only way people are interested in looking at it right now is "random people have a right to your shit without making an agreement to compensate you in any way for it and if you say anything about it you are ignorant and an extremist".

But it seems to me that if your political position is "We'll just move all 3.5 billion people who want to go to Europe and America over there,people who are wondering how it's physically possible for this plan to work,who have concerns about potential ramifications of this plan, or who would maybe like a vote on this or something are just ignorant extremists" you have maybe made a wrong turn somewhere.

Let me explain to you what you are doing here,on a philosophical level.
This is a hypothetical thought experiment.

If you deliberately move 3.5 billion,I dunno, let's say Irish people to someone else's country. Let's say we move them to India. When you do this,you know that Irish people have 10 kids per couple and Indians have 0.8 or 1.2 children per couple. Your stated goal is to change the ethnic composition of India for whatever reason,maybe Indians are lazy or they did slavery or something.

Under international law,you have committed a genocide. At the very least,what you're doing is ethnic cleansing.

And whether or not you describe it as ethnic cleansing or genocide or "happy funny friendly time", if one group of people moves to another group of people's country and starts running the government,that is called colonialism.

So,by condoning anti-nationalism as it is currently being practiced, you are sanctioning the Holocaust,slavery, colonialism, etc.

Unless you believe that people of some races are superior to people of other races,then if it's ok to do it to,let's say Sweden, then what would be wrong with trying to ethnically cleanse jews from Germany?

If it's ok for Pakistanis and Africans to run the government of Britain,then why was it wrong when Britain did it to Africans or Arabs?

And if it wasn't wrong, then what is the argument for doing it to Britain or Sweden?

The news I read usually says that the reason British people have to stop existing 100 or so years from now in any meaningful capacity is because of colonialism,likewise Germans because of the Holocaust, Americans because of slavery and colonialism,and so forth.

So,what is the actual reason this is happening?

I have a theory. What would you say if I told you that I believe that the people in power who made these decisions for all of us don't give a shit about you,me, or a single one of these refugees,economic migrants, or whatever other name we're calling them this news cycle?

What if this whole thing is motivated by the same thing that every war,every unjust domestic law, every environmentally-damaging decision by some faceless corporation is motivated by?

What if the root of all of this,as usual, is money? Insane amounts of money for a handful of billionaires that neither you,nor I, will ever see but that both of us will sweat and bleed to pay to these kleptocratic fat cats.

What if we've been duped?

Think about it.

These people collect all of our emails,text messages,phone calls,they lie to us,they gaslight us all the time.

Some of the women here can probably tell you that's not a healthy relationship to have with someone. That's what an abusive spouse does to someone,not a just government upholding the will of the people.

 

Your an idiot. Im not wasting anymore time talking to someone as stupid as you. Have a good day.

 

Oh wow the resident Nazi bitch has came out of her hole.

 

It's hard to be proud of our country now, given that healthcare is now failing, the police numbers have dropped so radically it's a criminal's land for the taking, we have a government determined to fill the mouths of the greedy corporate pigs... "four legs bad, two legs good"... the poor are getting poorer and in the 21st century we have more people living on the streets than ever before. Life is cheap and all about instant gratification.

And then you see how people rally round in the event of a tragedy, how communities work together, how religions work alongside each other, all races come together, and for a brief time it restores your faith in humanity.

Am I proud to be British?

I was. Once.

 

So,would you say that you are "intolerant" of me and you hate me?

By the way,it's "you're", smart guy.

Just because I don't espouse all the "correct" opinions of someone from your socioeconomic background doesn't mean that I am uninformed or unable to reason. Quite the opposite. The reason why people of your socioeconomic background favor those opinions is because they are uninformed or unable to reason.


Either that,or they are too cowardly to confront problems that are very large and complex. They simply want to describe some aspect of the problem,pin it on the "ignorance" and lack of social decorum of a lower socioeconomic class (usually White hillbillies or trailer trash, never their Mexican day laborer or inner city black socioeconomic counterparts) and then propose a SWPL'y Charlie Brown-type solution like "more education" or a bake sale or something to an existential question with global ramifications.

The reason you hate me is because I don't fit a particular stereotype. The problem of challenging my points is not as simple as repeating some talking points,feeling smarter than me, and then waving me away while everyone pats you on the back.

I'm just going to give you the bad news now. Going to school for longer or a better degree did not make you my boss,nor did it make you my intellectual superior. The only thing it conferred on you was debt and a piece of paper.

From the conversation we have had so far,it appears that I am in all respects smarter than you are.

I COULD take that fact and be like "Go back to the Young Turks and MSNBC and brush up on some more prolefeed mouthbreather opinions,moron!"

But I don't get a kick out of feeling smarter or hipper than other people.I like to actually read and think about complex subjects,not just buy a book by Neil deGrasse Tyson and show it to my friends so they think that I do.

 

I thought you couldn't possibly make yourself look more stupid , but you have ! Congrats! I also don't hate you those words never came out my mouth. I just think you are a troglodyte.( Look it up )

 

I do have a question for you though. Are you married to your first cousin? Do you have kids with your first cousin/ wife ? Are we as a society going to be burdened with more of your inbred ignorant kind for another generation? I hope not . I hope Darwin's theory holds true for you.

 

And yet, you don't seem to be able to grapple with a single one of the points I made,just point and "Wow,just wow" at me.

Maybe one of these days you'll figure out that knowing a three-syllable word or two doesn't make you intelligent.

I doubt you could describe the behaviors,the culture,or the day to day life of a troglodyte if someone put a gun to your head and your life depended on it.

Simply knowing the word "troglodyte" doesn't make you intelligent or any kind of a thinker.

 

So you have produced children with your first cousin/ wife . Well hopefully Darwin's theory will weed them out.

 

Wow,very mature and introspective. Deep,deep thoughts there.

You realize I can do this too?

Do you snort ambien and work at Starbucks? Are we as a society going to be burdened by your $80,000 in student loans for another generation?
When are you going to get in your first fistfight,so your balls can finally drop?

 

You know that's actually a racist thing to say,right? The majority of the cousin and sister marriages that take place in the world happen in Africa and the Middle East.

You should be more tolerant of different cultures.

 

I know it's hard to think between saluting your cutout of Tru.mp ( and wishing you could suck his cock) and ironing your Confederate flag and yelling go back to Mexico to a latinx person ( who probably isn't even Mexican) but try just this one time !